What Will Revive the Conference

[youngorst]

2 hours ago, Orange said:

Yeah, I don't believe this for a second, unless we're going to stop playing exclusively P5 bottom-feeders and no one better.  The likes of Michigan, Alabama, or Texas will never, EVER come to Corvallis.

Agree which is why they won't schedule those teams. Oklahoma State is coming in 2019, are they a bottom feeder? 

Playing 1 off road games was a DeCarolis/Riley thing. They have no such games scheduled through 2024 and Scott Barnes has made it clear he thinks such games are a mistake (when asked directly about next years trip to Columbus). And the only openings in their schedule are in 2023. Schools like Oklahoma State, Minnesota, Purdue, etc... will come to Corvallis so those are the schools you schedule. 

[Orange]

15 minutes ago, youngorst said:

Agree which is why they won't schedule those teams. Oklahoma State is coming in 2019, are they a bottom feeder? 

Playing 1 off road games was a DeCarolis/Riley thing. They have no such games scheduled through 2024 and Scott Barnes has made it clear he thinks such games are a mistake (when asked directly about next years trip to Columbus). And the only openings in their schedule are in 2023. Schools like Oklahoma State, Minnesota, Purdue, etc... will come to Corvallis so those are the schools you schedule. 

How soon til we run out of those schools to schedule?  Unless we're going to have years where we're exclusively playing G5 and FCS (which appears to be the case in 2022).

Our 2018 OOC is absolute dogshit.  @ tOSU (sure loss), Southern Utah (no glory either way) and @ Nevada (a very likely loss given our current performance levels).

Then off we go into Pac-12 play, probably 1-2, MAYBE 2-1 if we steal one in Reno, and perhaps 0-3 if we're anything like we were in 2017.  Fun!

PS: Don't feel like I'm being confrontational; I just have a habit of doing devil's advocate. I'd like more beaver fans to come here and post often.   We need each other like battered wives need each other in a shelter. 

[youngorst]

10 minutes ago, Orange said:

How soon til we run out of those schools to schedule?  Unless we're going to have years where we're exclusively playing G5 and FCS (which appears to be the case in 2022).

Our 2018 OOC is absolute dogshit.  @ tOSU (sure loss), Southern Utah (no glory either way) and @ Nevada (a very likely loss given our current performance levels).

Then off we go into Pac-12 play, probably 1-2, MAYBE 2-1 if we steal one in Reno, and perhaps 0-3 if we're anything like we were in 2017.  Fun!

PS: Don't feel like I'm being confrontational; I just have a habit of doing devil's advocate. I'd like more beaver fans to come here and post often.   We need each other like battered wives need each other in a shelter. 

Honestly, I have no interest in playing Alabama if they won't come to Corvallis. I'd rather play 2 G5 opponents and an FCS opponent than fail to get a return trip. At the end of the day until they expand Reser to 50,000 and consistently sell it out (in other words win more games) I see zero benefit to playing big time opponents in non-conference play. 

I might be open to scheduling neutral site games but they should never go play a road game without a return trip no matter who the opponent is. 

[All Hail]

1 minute ago, youngorst said:

Honestly, I have no interest in playing Alabama if they won't come to Corvallis. I'd rather play 2 G5 opponents and an FCS opponent than fail to get a return trip. At the end of the day until they expand Reser to 50,000 and consistently sell it out (in other words win more games) I see zero benefit to playing big time opponents in non-conference play. 

I might be open to scheduling neutral site games but they should never go play a road game without a return trip no matter who the opponent is. 

This applies to all Pac 12 teams.  We cannot let members of this conference be treated by FCS schools.  

[Utefan1211]

In agreement with most of what is said. 

Pac12 does not stack up to the rest of the  leagues as far as regional fan excitement. I have spent too much time in Knoxville, TN and I witnessed multiple times what it means to have the "Regional" pride. Going to a game is a major event. Tens of thousands of fans from both schools come at least a day or two early. The houseboats flood the Cumberland River and everyone sings Rocky Top til they puke. The game is not even the culmination. Many of the fans don't leave until Sunday evening to talk about what they could have done better as a team and how they will "get em' next year".  

Someone said that there really isn't much to do in these other regions compared to the Pac 12. That is 100% true. Get drunk and get laid was the motto of half my staff out there. Doesn't sound half bad but there is truly a lack of things to do. No beach, no ski, very few play golf and much of the population has very little education.  Their entire week revolves around "the game". 

[Orange]

17 minutes ago, youngorst said:

Honestly, I have no interest in playing Alabama if they won't come to Corvallis. I'd rather play 2 G5 opponents and an FCS opponent than fail to get a return trip. At the end of the day until they expand Reser to 50,000 and consistently sell it out (in other words win more games) I see zero benefit to playing big time opponents in non-conference play. 

I might be open to scheduling neutral site games but they should never go play a road game without a return trip no matter who the opponent is. 

I agree 100%.

But right now, we fill 80% of the 2nd smallest stadium in the Pac-12, so....

[Orange]

12 minutes ago, Utefan1211 said:

In agreement with most of what is said. 

Pac12 does not stack up to the rest of the  leagues as far as regional fan excitement. I have spent too much time in Knoxville, TN and I witnessed multiple times what it means to have the "Regional" pride. Going to a game is a major event. Tens of thousands of fans from both schools come at least a day or two early. The houseboats flood the Cumberland River and everyone sings Rocky Top til they puke. The game is not even the culmination. Many of the fans don't leave until Sunday evening to talk about what they could have done better as a team and how they will "get em' next year".  

Someone said that there really isn't much to do in these other regions compared to the Pac 12. That is 100% true. Get drunk and get laid was the motto of half my staff out there. Doesn't sound half bad but there is truly a lack of things to do. No beach, no ski, very few play golf and much of the population has very little education.  Their entire week revolves around "the game". 

Honestly, that strikes me as an incredibly sad life.  But they sure seem to be happy....

[utenation]

18 minutes ago, Utefan1211 said:

 

Someone said that there really isn't much to do in these other regions compared to the Pac 12. That is 100% true. Get drunk and get laid was the motto of half my staff out there. Doesn't sound half bad but there is truly a lack of things to do. No beach, no ski, very few play golf and much of the population has very little education.  Their entire week revolves around "the game". 

This made me laugh.. And there are other things to do in SEC country,  Fun is always relative..

 

[EastCoastFan]

On the issue of non-conference scheduling, I see no reason why Pac-12 teams shouldn't schedule two P5 games and one G5 game.  In a couple of cases Pac-12 schools have scheduled three P5 out-of-conference games.  Stanford already has locked in KSU, Vandy, and Notre Dame in 2021, and TCU, Vandy and Notre Dame in 2024.  It sounds like a couple of other schedules also will show that.

As for scheduling two P5 out-of-conference teams, it's not that hard.  Just as an example, Colorado has locked in (with home-and-homes) A&M and Minnesota in 2021; TCU and Minnesota in 2022; TCU and Nebraska in 2023; Georgia Tech and Northwestern in 2026; and Northwestern and KSU in 2027.  There's no reason Pac-12 schools can't figure a way to schedule two out-of-conference games with P5 teams, especially with schools like Maryland, Indiana, Illinois, Texas Tech, Kansas, Iowa State, Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Mississippi State, Wake Forest, Duke, KSU, and Purdue all looking for opponents.

If schools from a name conference are on the schedule, some of the Pac-12's problems with attendance and TV interest ought to evaporate.

[glduck]

32 minutes ago, Downthefield said:

On the issue of non-conference scheduling, I see no reason why Pac-12 teams shouldn't schedule two P5 games and one G5 game.  In a couple of cases Pac-12 schools have scheduled three P5 out-of-conference games.  Stanford already has locked in KSU, Vandy, and Notre Dame in 2021, and TCU, Vandy and Notre Dame in 2024.  It sounds like a couple of other schedules also will show that.

As for scheduling two P5 out-of-conference teams, it's not that hard.  Just as an example, Colorado has locked in (with home-and-homes) A&M and Minnesota in 2021; TCU and Minnesota in 2022; TCU and Nebraska in 2023; Georgia Tech and Northwestern in 2026; and Northwestern and KSU in 2027.  There's no reason Pac-12 schools can't figure a way to schedule two out-of-conference games with P5 teams, especially with schools like Maryland, Indiana, Illinois, Texas Tech, Kansas, Iowa State, Boston College, Syracuse, Rutgers, Mississippi State, Wake Forest, Duke, KSU, and Purdue all looking for opponents.

If schools from a name conference are on the schedule, some of the Pac-12's problems with attendance and TV interest ought to evaporate.

 

while not trying to pick apart your point, i lol'd because:

1. you tried thinking of the worst of the worst P5 teams, and going from memory the pac-12 went 1-3 against those sad sack teams in 2017;

2. this flies in the face of the other popular argument pac-12 fans like to make, that being we need to get down to 8 conference games and schedule as soft as possible to give ourselves the best possible chance at the playoff.

[EastCoastFan]

1 hour ago, glduck said:

 

while not trying to pick apart your point, i lol'd because:

1. you tried thinking of the worst of the worst P5 teams, and going from memory the pac-12 went 1-3 against those sad sack teams in 2017;

2. this flies in the face of the other popular argument pac-12 fans like to make, that being we need to get down to 8 conference games and schedule as soft as possible to give ourselves the best possible chance at the playoff.

What I was attempting to say was that if a team like Colorado can schedule two P5 teams a year, any Pac-12 school ought to be able to.  Even Oregon State with the schools I listed.  And if Stanford can schedule three P5 schools, teams like Oregon shouldn't be "bulking up" with things like their "notable" 2018 out-of-conference schedule, with the killer lineup of Bowling Green, Portland State, and San Jose State.  A slate like that will rivet fans of college football from coast to coast to watching the Ducks.....

[glduck]

would a few extra eyeballs in early September make up for the extra losses we’d undoubtedly pick up playing three P5 teams each? there’s only so many bad teams out there, and like i pointed out, we can’t exactly be counted on to beat those teams consistently as is...

honestly I’ve never heard this argument. it’s a nice thought in terms of competiveness, but it would never ever happen and it seems logistically nigh-impossible. 

oregon’s 2018 schedule is in part a result of a P5 team backing out of a home and home. that’s a whole other issue... in the last 12 years, georgia, texas a&m, and indiana have backed out of scheduled games with us. we’ve backed out on a game against nevada in the past to get oklahoma on the schedule. it seems to be an issue amongst us P5’ers. not sure we can trust other schools from screwing up our schedules.

[Bruininthebay]

Be realistic.  It's not likely other conferences will follow our lead.  The SEC is not going to schedule many Mountain West  or American West division teams - the majority of SEC schools out of conference schedule starts with one Conference USA game, one Sun Belt game and one FCS game and reluctantly they play a good out of conference game.

UCLA and USC have scheduled this way since the split was made between "college" and "university" inter collegiate football.   Stanford mostly did as well for a while too.

Perhaps a limitation to in-state FCS schools is reasonable because these schools have relationships that go beyond athletics because of state funding and research, but otherwise it's not beneficial to pad the schedule with a game that is not competitive. 

Even without a limitation there are 18 schools between the Mountain West and the American's West division, plus BYU and New Mexico State, so it's easy to find games that would be more competitive than the present out of conference schedules that Oregon State, Washington State, and until this upcoming season, Washington have with FCS matchups. 

imho Utah is a good example where they really ought to play Utah State and BYU annually because they are both decent rivalries for the Utes, plus one good out of conference game.  They should put their schedule on auto pilot and leave Utah for a power conference road game, in conference road games and bowls only.

Who doesn't want to road trip to San Diego, Las Vegas or Hawaii?  I'd personally include Reno in the fall too.

[KUGRDON]

I don’t know how long it’s been since a P5 team came to Pullman.  When scheduled as part of a home and home, they simply buy out of the trip to Pullman.  (Last P5 in Pullman, Illinois 1998).

[EastCoastFan]

14 minutes ago, KUGRDON said:

I don’t know how long it’s been since a P5 team came to Pullman.  When scheduled as part of a home and home, they simply buy out of the trip to Pullman.

I know that it is hard, but Washington State does have scheduled upcoming home games with both Wisconsin and Kansas State as home-and-homes.  In the past, outside of Rutgers (and Utah and Colorado before they were Pac-12) coming to Pullman, the solution was to schedule games in Seattle, with games with Oklahoma State and Baylor (and also, more neutral in location, Notre Dame was played in San Antonio in 2009).  With WSU and OSU, an agreement with the Big Ten for an annual conference challenge would offer home-and-homes with a P5 opponent, a big advantage.  The B1G wanted it (I have direct knowledge of their offer), but the Pac-12 had internal opposition and pulled out of the deal.

[EastCoastFan]

30 minutes ago, potrerosf said:

Who doesn't want to road trip to San Diego, Las Vegas or Hawaii?  I'd personally include Reno in the fall too.

Wasn't this a thread about "What will revive the conference"?  A game playing SD State or Nevada will do that?  It's TV ratings and media deals that drives the competitiveness and cashflow of football conferences.  A road trip to Vegas or Hawaii will fix that?

[KUGRDON]

1 hour ago, Downthefield said:

I know that it is hard, but Washington State does have scheduled upcoming home games with both Wisconsin and Kansas State as home-and-homes.  In the past, outside of Rutgers (and Utah and Colorado before they were Pac-12) coming to Pullman, the solution was to schedule games in Seattle, with games with Oklahoma State and Baylor (and also, more neutral in location, Notre Dame was played in San Antonio in 2009).  With WSU and OSU, an agreement with the Big Ten for an annual conference challenge would offer home-and-homes with a P5 opponent, a big advantage.  The B1G wanted it (I have direct knowledge of their offer), but the Pac-12 had internal opposition and pulled out of the deal.

Wisconsin will never see Pullman.  You fail to acknowledge the importance of money, and it’s growing influence.  Money is getting more important, not less.  Wisconsin would make three or four times as much with a home body bag game.  Probably more.  And guess what, nobody gives a rats azz about September games.

Put on your schedulers hat.  WSU calls asking you to go to Pullman, three problems 1) no money; 2) risk of losing; 3) WSU rep not so good that a win has any value.  Why would you say yes?  Fan excitement about Illinois coming to Pullman in a conference challenge?  really laughable.

[Chad Sexington]

Entirely too much is being made of one down year. The PAC12 handicaps itself with 9 conference games, terrible scheduling and an insistence of the California schools on both playing each other every year and including late season games OOC. The only problem this league has is soft interior lines. Correct that, balance schedules and tell bspn to take a flying fuck at a rolling doughnut, and we'll be fine. I predict a deep run by a PAC team next year. 

[EastCoastFan]

Yeah,  I guess you guys are right.  We can't do anything about scheduling P5 teams because they'll cancel on us.  We can't even trust the games that the games we have scheduled will be played.  And an innovative inter-league arrangement wouldn't work because who knows, we might play the same teams again in bowls, and who would want that.  If Utah just schedules BYU and USU, the Oregon teams stay close to Portland State, the Washington teams lock down Eastern Washington, and Northern Arizona is a regular for ASU and Zona, we'll all be fine.  Nobody east of the Rockies is going to watch us anyway.  And other than our notoriously soft interior lines, and a need to cut one conference game so we ditch the brutal nine game Pac-12 schedule, and we'll be just fine.  We're only $5 million per school behind the muscled Big XII, and we'll never be able to compete with the B1G or SEC as they push for $55-$60 million per school.  No need for this thread.

[PAC MAN]

3 hours ago, Chad Sexington said:

Entirely too much is being made of one down year. The PAC12 handicaps itself with 9 conference games, terrible scheduling and an insistence of the California schools on both playing each other every year and including late season games OOC. The only problem this league has is soft interior lines. Correct that, balance schedules and tell bspn to take a flying fuck at a rolling doughnut, and we'll be fine. I predict a deep run by a PAC team next year. 

There's some truth to that...those programs that stay strong for long periods of times were able to do so with strong interior lines.  I'd say those strong interior lines that the Utes have had as member of the Pac-12 would be a big factor in why they have done pretty well in the conference for a former MWC team.