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Picking Up The Pieces


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On 7/21/2022 at 5:24 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

Sorry if facts confuse you. If you want to post what football stadium naming rights amounts the PAC-X schools have in excess of the $3M/yr that SDSU is getting  I will gladly admit if I am wrong.

By the way. I feel bad for Cronin. He took a job in the PAC-12, first good coaching hire in years for UCLA (remember Alford?) and then he gets screwed over with a move to the BIG. Travel will be a total bitch and the BIG plays a game more like the MWC, big physical guys up front, than the PAC-X. UCLA BB is going to suffer some but this move is all about football and supporting your big brother, USC, in a move driven by football, not basketball.

SDSU will gladly take a place in PAC BB and do well from the start. Preseason ratings already have us in the top 15.

That's a lot of mental gymnastics. Normally I don't mind wallowing in the mud with pigs but I've seen goalposts move enough already that I know I'll get some excuse and adjustment of statements followed by a change of direction of topics. Like this Cronin discussion and asking if I remember Alford. What can I expect from someone who keeps referring to the MSL like it's a thing.

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On 7/21/2022 at 7:49 PM, MrBug708 said:

That's a lot of mental gymnastics. Normally I don't mind wallowing in the mud with pigs but I've seen goalposts move enough already that I know I'll get some excuse and adjustment of statements followed by a change of direction of topics. Like this Cronin discussion and asking if I remember Alford. What can I expect from someone who keeps referring to the MSL like it's a thing.

Mental gymnastics?  Really? Sorry, I don't have crayons to draw a picture for you, and. now I am am a pig. You guys are funny, nice to know I am getting under your skin for no reason.

1. UCLA will have more difficultly playing BB in the BIG, Travel will be a huge issue. Also,  I  have said, the BIG plays a different game than UCLA has in the PAC. To be honest, the BIG plays a lot like the MWC. Big guys up front playing physical.  UCLA is following USC football to the BIG. If you don't realize it is about USC football, not UCLA basketball, then you will learn in the next few years. Personally, I thing this is a bad move for UCLA overall and UCLA basketball in particular. UCLA's football program isn't very good, and they barely get half of the Rose Bowl filled. That will get a lot worse when they are in the lower 3rd of the BIG.  UCLA has said they had to do this move so save cutting Olympic sports. That is BS. They will be dropping OLY sports left and right once they join the BIG. Travel to the BIG10 will kill that and they can't dump those sports in the MWC or BIg West.

2. I only mention the MSL as  potential tenant to our stadium. If they do come here they will be paying off some of the stadium debt (because they will want an ownership interest, which helps fund the stadium) while adding income to SDSU. That's a good thing.  We don't need a MSL team to make the stadium profitable, nor is it figured in the current financials.

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On 7/21/2022 at 9:21 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

Mental gymnastics?  Really? Sorry, I don't have crayons to draw a picture for you, and. now I am am a pig. You guys are funny, nice to know I am getting under your skin for no reason.

1. UCLA will have more difficultly playing BB in the BIG, Travel will be a huge issue. Also,  I  have said, the BIG plays a different game than UCLA has in the PAC. To be honest, the BIG plays a lot like the MWC. Big guys up front playing physical.  UCLA is following USC football to the BIG. If you don't realize it is about USC football, not UCLA basketball, then you will learn in the next few years. Personally, I thing this is a bad move for UCLA overall and UCLA basketball in particular. UCLA's football program isn't very good, and they barely get half of the Rose Bowl filled. That will get a lot worse when they are in the lower 3rd of the BIG.  UCLA has said they had to do this move so save cutting Olympic sports. That is BS. They will be dropping OLY sports left and right once they join the BIG. Travel to the BIG10 will kill that and they can't dump those sports in the MWC or BIg West.

2. I only mention the MSL as  potential tenant to our stadium. If they do come here they will be paying off some of the stadium debt (because they will want an ownership interest, which helps fund the stadium) while adding income to SDSU. That's a good thing.  We don't need a MSL team to make the stadium profitable, nor is it figured in the current financials.

Both schools already have sports in the MPSF. The Big West and WCC would gladly take any other Oly sports if it really came down to it, heck even the MWC would make exceptions for them like they do for Hawaii in football and Colorado College in soccer. Having athletes compete in sports against two of the most tradition rich schools in the country? The chance to compete against Olympians on a regular basis? No conference other than the PAC-12 to save face would really turn them down, but I guarantee they'll keep scheduling them non-conference because of the Olympic talent that comes out of SoCal for a lot of sports. Personally though outside of basketball, volleyball, and maybe soccer, and lacrosse the travel issue is a bit overblown. Even with basketball it's only 10 road games, 9 really if they keep USC/UCLA as a home & home series. I don't see them increasing the number of conference games as that would just kill RPI/NET down the stretch. All they have to do is load up on Big West, WCC and MWC for non-conference games and then they don't have to leave the state except for a few national games and tournaments until conference play starts. 

Other Olympic sports like golf, track & field, cross country and swimming & diving are just weird. Some don't even compete against each other until their conference tournaments startup. So the LA schools will have minimal travel in most sports already since they will just compete against local competition as usual. 

Softball/baseball is 24 conference games total, broken into 3 game series so 4 home and 4 away series. They'll both play each other in baseball at least once, and only UCLA plays softball. Both schools typically already play a lot of in-state competition for non-conference. I doubt the PAC will stop playing them as they recruit SoCal heavily. 

Men's Tennis only plays 9 soon to possibly be 11 matches and women's tennis plays 11 soon to possibly be 13 matches. So 4 or 5 away men's matches and 5 or 6 in women's really isn't terrible. Again, just load up on in-state teams and play more non-conference tournaments closer to home. 

Women's soccer currently plays 10 matches possibly soon to be 12 and the B1G already cuts down on travel by having some teams play each other twice so they can just do that for the LA schools and they would only have to travel east 5 times. 

Only UCLA plays men's soccer which the B1G currently plays 8 matches possibly soon to be either 9 since they play each other once. 4 or 5 times going east again isn't terrible if you just play your non-conference at home. But I can definitely see these sports struggling a bit too. 

Only USC plays women's lacrosse and the B1G plays 6 possibly soon to be 7 games. I can see USC struggling in this sport heavily as it is new and like its male counterpart is popular on the east coast. I wouldn't be surprised if USC dropped this into another conference or dropped it altogether and finally figuring out a way to field a softball team. 

Volleyball plays 20 conference matches in a season, so 10 home/away and only 9 would be truly on the road if they keep home & homes for the LA schools. But the B1G is typically the #1 volleyball conference with the PAC-12 a close second and has now solidified itself as the #1 conference for years to come. Expect the conference to figure out some way to create an accommodating schedule for this sport and basketball. 

 

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On 7/21/2022 at 10:03 PM, MrBug708 said:

1. Thank you for you unsolicited feedback on UCLA. It's obvious that you don't really follow UCLA, like at all.

2. Please use crayons to explain what the "MSL" is.

Without getting political, realize that he's a trump supporter, so his IQ is likely around room temperature. 

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On 7/21/2022 at 4:45 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

Again, I am comparing apples to apples. SDSU's naming rights for their FOOTBALL STADIUM as it stand right now is 3rd, behind UW and USC in the country. $3M/year for 15 years = $45M will other schools do better than that in the coming years, sure as shit yeah? But that is where things stand now. Our deal is better than 10 members of the PAC-12 as it stands now. You really want to argue that? Again, so far naming rights for the stadium and certain areas of the stadium, including the field, exceeds more than $70M. We can add "stadium gifts/PSLs" in excess of $20M right now.

Yes, we designed this stadium to do more than college football. Duh, why wouldn't we? It is designed a bit larger (field dimensions) to accommodate soccer. Still, you will be much closer to the action for football than many other college stadiums. Of course we want a MLS team to come here, why not? Our numbers already work well without MSL. If they do decide to come here, and they would ask for an ownership interest, then our numbers get even better. Do we need and MSL team? No. Do we want one, of course. The more uses a stadium gets the more profitable it becomes.

I do not understand why you keep bringing up Pauley. What naming rights do y'all get from the Rose Bowl? Again, good for them for getting so much money for their naming rights. That has nothing to do with what we are doing in San Diego. Again, I am just saying how our new stadium compares to the naming rights of other college football stadiums. Sorry that so many schools in the PAC haven't done more to make more money with stadium naming rights. Don't blame me for that.

Of course, naming rights for a P5 school is generally going to exceed that of a G5 school at least, as this goes, to basketball. In the MWC where we play the majority of our games on CBSSN we get $690K per year for the arena naming rights. I think that contract with Viejas goes for another 7 years . Once y'all wave bye-bye to UCLA and UCLA then you are left with two schools that can be considered "elite" in BB. That is Arizona and Oregon. SDSU already competes with the PAC in BB. Again, Viejas will get a lot of their bang for the buck on their current contract. They are a local tribe, however.  I will say, Gonzaga, UCLA, USC and Arizona won't schedule a home-and-home with us. Why? Stanford just did. ASU doesn't seem to have an issue as well.

 

 

The funny part is, his one proper use ("MLS") was an accident, and he quickly went back to "MSL" over and over.

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On 7/21/2022 at 9:21 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

Mental gymnastics?  Really? Sorry, I don't have crayons to draw a picture for you, and. now I am am a pig. You guys are funny, nice to know I am getting under your skin for no reason.

1. UCLA will have more difficultly playing BB in the BIG, Travel will be a huge issue. Also,  I  have said, the BIG plays a different game than UCLA has in the PAC. To be honest, the BIG plays a lot like the MWC. Big guys up front playing physical.  UCLA is following USC football to the BIG. If you don't realize it is about USC football, not UCLA basketball, then you will learn in the next few years. Personally, I thing this is a bad move for UCLA overall and UCLA basketball in particular. UCLA's football program isn't very good, and they barely get half of the Rose Bowl filled. That will get a lot worse when they are in the lower 3rd of the BIG.  UCLA has said they had to do this move so save cutting Olympic sports. That is BS. They will be dropping OLY sports left and right once they join the BIG. Travel to the BIG10 will kill that and they can't dump those sports in the MWC or BIg West.

2. I only mention the MSL as  potential tenant to our stadium. If they do come here they will be paying off some of the stadium debt (because they will want an ownership interest, which helps fund the stadium) while adding income to SDSU. That's a good thing.  We don't need a MSL team to make the stadium profitable, nor is it figured in the current financials.

I don't think you're under anyone's skin; rather, it's just clear you aren't here to engage in actual discussion about the Pac-12 and the current issues it's facing.  

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On 7/21/2022 at 11:48 PM, Trojan209 said:

Both schools already have sports in the MPSF. The Big West and WCC would gladly take any other Oly sports if it really came down to it, heck even the MWC would make exceptions for them like they do for Hawaii in football and Colorado College in soccer. Having athletes compete in sports against two of the most tradition rich schools in the country? The chance to compete against Olympians on a regular basis? No conference other than the PAC-12 to save face would really turn them down, but I guarantee they'll keep scheduling them non-conference because of the Olympic talent that comes out of SoCal for a lot of sports. Personally though outside of basketball, volleyball, and maybe soccer, and lacrosse the travel issue is a bit overblown. Even with basketball it's only 10 road games, 9 really if they keep USC/UCLA as a home & home series. I don't see them increasing the number of conference games as that would just kill RPI/NET down the stretch. All they have to do is load up on Big West, WCC and MWC for non-conference games and then they don't have to leave the state except for a few national games and tournaments until conference play starts. 

Other Olympic sports like golf, track & field, cross country and swimming & diving are just weird. Some don't even compete against each other until their conference tournaments startup. So the LA schools will have minimal travel in most sports already since they will just compete against local competition as usual. 

Softball/baseball is 24 conference games total, broken into 3 game series so 4 home and 4 away series. They'll both play each other in baseball at least once, and only UCLA plays softball. Both schools typically already play a lot of in-state competition for non-conference. I doubt the PAC will stop playing them as they recruit SoCal heavily. 

Men's Tennis only plays 9 soon to possibly be 11 matches and women's tennis plays 11 soon to possibly be 13 matches. So 4 or 5 away men's matches and 5 or 6 in women's really isn't terrible. Again, just load up on in-state teams and play more non-conference tournaments closer to home. 

Women's soccer currently plays 10 matches possibly soon to be 12 and the B1G already cuts down on travel by having some teams play each other twice so they can just do that for the LA schools and they would only have to travel east 5 times. 

Only UCLA plays men's soccer which the B1G currently plays 8 matches possibly soon to be either 9 since they play each other once. 4 or 5 times going east again isn't terrible if you just play your non-conference at home. But I can definitely see these sports struggling a bit too. 

Only USC plays women's lacrosse and the B1G plays 6 possibly soon to be 7 games. I can see USC struggling in this sport heavily as it is new and like its male counterpart is popular on the east coast. I wouldn't be surprised if USC dropped this into another conference or dropped it altogether and finally figuring out a way to field a softball team. 

Volleyball plays 20 conference matches in a season, so 10 home/away and only 9 would be truly on the road if they keep home & homes for the LA schools. But the B1G is typically the #1 volleyball conference with the PAC-12 a close second and has now solidified itself as the #1 conference for years to come. Expect the conference to figure out some way to create an accommodating schedule for this sport and basketball. 

 

The Big West is already overloaded with teams. There would be no reason for them to add UCLA or USC teams. especially when USC and UCLA will have a huge advantage with financing. Why would a triple A team want to compete against the Yankees? Sorry, USC and UCLA have committed their OLY teams to the BIG, and travel will be hugely expensive. First mens team to go will be track and field and cross country. Note, I actually was a distance runner that got a scholarship for a UC school. Track and field has a lot of athletes needed but costs a lot to travel. Too bad, UCLA had one of the best distance running coaches in the world, Bob Larsen, and within a couple of years they won't have the T&F or CC teams.

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On 7/22/2022 at 6:42 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

The Big West is already overloaded with teams. There would be no reason for them to add UCLA or USC teams. especially when USC and UCLA will have a huge advantage with financing. Why would a triple A team want to compete against the Yankees? Sorry, USC and UCLA have committed their OLY teams to the BIG, and travel will be hugely expensive. First mens team to go will be track and field and cross country. Note, I actually was a distance runner that got a scholarship for a UC school. Track and field has a lot of athletes needed but costs a lot to travel. Too bad, UCLA had one of the best distance running coaches in the world, Bob Larsen, and within a couple of years they won't have the T&F or CC teams.

I doubt it, but I guess we'll see. Just a quick look at both schools schedules the last few years tells me that their schedule in the B1G won't change other than traveling to the conference championship sites. The MPSF does sponsor men's and women's indoor T&F, I doubt the B1G will mind letting them park their teams there if it came down to it. Like you said, if the Big West is overloaded with 11 schools then why would the B1G want to add 2 more for 16? The MPSF only has 6 men's indoor teams. I doubt they'll mind as they already compete against the LA schools, plus Stanford and Cal in a bunch of other sports. The Triple A vs Yankees reference makes no sense based on the MPSF sports sponsored, you don't really see them complaining about always losing to the bigger funded schools. They sure do like bragging about the hundreds of NCAA titles that the big 4 California schools have from those sports alone. 

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On 7/22/2022 at 8:59 PM, Trojan209 said:

I doubt it, but I guess we'll see. Just a quick look at both schools schedules the last few years tells me that their schedule in the B1G won't change other than traveling to the conference championship sites. The MPSF does sponsor men's and women's indoor T&F, I doubt the B1G will mind letting them park their teams there if it came down to it. Like you said, if the Big West is overloaded with 11 schools then why would the B1G want to add 2 more for 16? The MPSF only has 6 men's indoor teams. I doubt they'll mind as they already compete against the LA schools, plus Stanford and Cal in a bunch of other sports. The Triple A vs Yankees reference makes no sense based on the MPSF sports sponsored, you don't really see them complaining about always losing to the bigger funded schools. They sure do like bragging about the hundreds of NCAA titles that the big 4 California schools have from those sports alone. 

Travel East is much harder than travel west. That is why I don't see Gonzaga in the Big East even though they fit perfectly outside of location. I was a CC runner and men's Track and Field and CC are the first Oly sports cut because it is the most expensive non-revenue sport

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On 7/22/2022 at 5:40 PM, duckfandan said:

I don't think you're under anyone's skin; rather, it's just clear you aren't here to engage in actual discussion about the Pac-12 and the current issues it's facing.  

It's also clear the members of this Board have an elitist attitude towards a Cal State joining their ranks.

Why ?

Adding SDSU may not be the home run that adding an OUT, but it will fill a part of  the black hole in the valuable SoCal market that U$CLA has created.

 

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On 7/22/2022 at 9:59 PM, Trojan209 said:

I doubt it, but I guess we'll see. Just a quick look at both schools schedules the last few years tells me that their schedule in the B1G won't change other than traveling to the conference championship sites. The MPSF does sponsor men's and women's indoor T&F, I doubt the B1G will mind letting them park their teams there if it came down to it. Like you said, if the Big West is overloaded with 11 schools then why would the B1G want to add 2 more for 16? The MPSF only has 6 men's indoor teams. I doubt they'll mind as they already compete against the LA schools, plus Stanford and Cal in a bunch of other sports. The Triple A vs Yankees reference makes no sense based on the MPSF sports sponsored, you don't really see them complaining about always losing to the bigger funded schools. They sure do like bragging about the hundreds of NCAA titles that the big 4 California schools have from those sports alone. 

Those Oly Sports rarely bring eyeballs or tv revenue.

Football drives the bus. Period. Right now, SDSU may not be the sexiest bus, but the PAC needs it.

 

Abigail Breslin Ride GIF

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On 7/24/2022 at 6:08 AM, Spaztecs said:

It's also clear the members of this Board have an elitist attitude towards a Cal State joining their ranks.

Why ?

Adding SDSU may not be the home run that adding an OUT, but it will fill a part of  the black hole in the valuable SoCal market that U$CLA has created.

 

Interesting that an Oregon St fan would even think they deserve an elitist attitude. I live in California, that means I own an elitist attitude unless your are in NYC or Chicago. You may get small pass in Seattle or Portland, though both of those cities are piles of excrement.

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On 7/24/2022 at 6:13 AM, Spaztecs said:

Those Oly Sports rarely bring eyeballs or tv revenue.

Football drives the bus. Period. Right now, SDSU may not be the sexiest bus, but the PAC needs it.

 

Abigail Breslin Ride GIF

I think it's pretty apparent to everyone that this is about football. @Aztecgolferand I were just discussing the impact the move to the B1G will have on Oly sports and whether some will be dropped or not. 

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On 7/24/2022 at 1:41 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

Interesting that an Oregon St fan would even think they deserve an elitist attitude. I live in California, that means I own an elitist attitude unless your are in NYC or Chicago. You may get small pass in Seattle or Portland, though both of those cities are piles of excrement.

Cool story, bro.

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On 7/24/2022 at 1:41 PM, Aztecgolfer said:

Interesting that an Oregon St fan would even think they deserve an elitist attitude. I live in California, that means I own an elitist attitude unless your are in NYC or Chicago. You may get small pass in Seattle or Portland, though both of those cities are piles of excrement.

And this is why literally no one here takes you seriously.  Come on, talk about how Black Lives Matter protestors are terrorists or some shit, you know you want to, fascist.

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On 7/24/2022 at 6:08 AM, Spaztecs said:

It's also clear the members of this Board have an elitist attitude towards a Cal State joining their ranks.

Why ?

Adding SDSU may not be the home run that adding an OUT, but it will fill a part of  the black hole in the valuable SoCal market that U$CLA has created.

 

Nobody's arguing that SoCal isn't a valuable market.  We're just pointing out that SD State football in no way is a draw for that market.  At all.  

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On 7/25/2022 at 8:51 AM, Orange said:

Nobody's arguing that SoCal isn't a valuable market.  We're just pointing out that SD State football in no way is a draw for that market.  At all.  

To be fair there would most likely be a bump in the tv audience if they moved up to the PAC-12. Similar to what happened with Utah, TCU, and Louisville. But in terms of recruiting there aren't nearly a large number of recruits out of SD compared to LA. I think the 2022 recruiting class only had 12 recruits with D1 offers and only 7 with P5 offers. But does SDSU suddenly become worth $30M+ simply by joining the PAC-12? I would have my doubts. But it's an interesting point that I'm sure the people at the top are looking into. 

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