MrBug708 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 https://www.google.com/amp/amp.si.com/college-basketball/2017/10/25/oregon-kavell-bigby-williams-title-ix-investigation Doesn't really surprise me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Hail Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Altman is a known scumbag. Letting that rapist from Providence on campus was all I needed to know about the guy. Seems like he’s led the league in sexual harassment by a country mile since he was hired. But he is a really good coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogueDuck Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 2 hours ago, All Hail said: Altman is a known scumbag. Letting that rapist from Providence on campus was all I needed to know about the guy. Seems like he’s led the league in sexual harassment by a country mile since he was hired. But he is a really good coach. So no due process? In All hails world accused = guilty and should be booted. None of them were ever found guilty. The Knicks did their investigation and found no wrong doing by Dotson, and "the rapist" is on the 76ers D league team. As for Bigby LSU took him, Texas Tech Witchita St and SDSU all pursued him before he chose LSU. According to Wyoming police no charges were ever, or will ever be filed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBug708 Posted October 26, 2017 Author Share Posted October 26, 2017 Legally there is no issue. Being a scumbag doesn't need to be attached to a criminal conviction. Altman chose winning over having a possible rapist on the team and there wasn't anything illegal about it. But as long as other coaches are cool with it, I guess that makes it ok. When you work as a cop and you are under investigation for rape, you don't get to work. As a teacher, the same thing. Most jobs don't need a conviction to suspend, pending investigation Side note, the NCAA cares more about a player getting a house than it does either rape or players taking fake classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glduck Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 is there new information in the article? apologies, i saw it yesterday but it's long as shit and i haven't had time to read it. when the bigby-williams thing broke, like, five months ago i said that altman and his staff skirt the boundaries of legality and that oregon is basically a halfway house for sexual misconduct. whether or not bigby-williams was guilty, the university failed to uphold its own bylaws. that seems to be indisputable. and that's what really bugs me: the awful, trump-ian cover-ups. many coaches take chances on iffy players -- regardless of sport, and he's hardly the only conference coach who would have taken brandon austin -- but altman has had a few that have blown up in his face, and instead of admitting the mistake the university has dug itself a hole on more than one occasion. i'm on record saying i thought the dotson/artis thing was bunk -- fight me -- but there WAS an ongoing investigation and the basketball program put its head in the sand, LIED, and a few players played in the tournament that really should not have. then the university tried covering it up. the university president made a huge ass of himself talking to a student reporter trying to brush aside the bigby-williams thing several months ago, and several departments started pointing fingers at other departments. it's all transparently fake. they fucked up and got caught. please don't read this bol bol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KUGRDON Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 3 hours ago, MrBug708 said: Legally there is no issue. Being a scumbag doesn't need to be attached to a criminal conviction. Altman chose winning over having a possible rapist on the team and there wasn't anything illegal about it. But as long as other coaches are cool with it, I guess that makes it ok. When you work as a cop and you are under investigation for rape, you don't get to work. As a teacher, the same thing. Most jobs don't need a conviction to suspend, pending investigation Side note, the NCAA cares more about a player getting a house than it does either rape or players taking fake classes. But don’t teachers and cops get paid anyway, pending completion of the investigation? Due process can be a bitch, but a necessary one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Hail Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 11 minutes ago, KUGRDON said: But don’t teachers and cops get paid anyway, pending completion of the investigation? Due process can be a bitch, but a necessary one. I think campuses have an obligation to remove students who they have a strong reason to believe are dangerous to campus. If a student was accused of murder, he should not be allowed to walk the campus while his due process is figured out. If a student is a accused of rape and there is strong witness evidence that he very well might be a rapist, I don't think he should be allowed to prowl the campus. The university is hiding behind due process and plausible deniability and they are doing so intentionally for the sole purpose of benefiting their athletic department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBug708 Posted October 26, 2017 Author Share Posted October 26, 2017 46 minutes ago, KUGRDON said: But don’t teachers and cops get paid anyway, pending completion of the investigation? Due process can be a bitch, but a necessary one. Often, nobody said he should lose his scholarship durong the investigation. Of course, shame on the police department who hires a guy knowingly under investigation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KUGRDON Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 2 minutes ago, MrBug708 said: Often, nobody said he should lose his scholarship durong the investigation. Of course, shame on the police department who hires a guy knowingly under investigation. I think AH just did, insofar as keeping them off campus generally denies them the benefits of scholarships, as many do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Hail Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 5 minutes ago, KUGRDON said: I think AH just did, insofar as keeping them off campus generally denies them the benefits of scholarships, as many do. He can keep his scholarship, but should be removed from campus pending the investigation, which would probably end up in his favor as it takes an almost perfect storm for these guys to get charged and convicted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KUGRDON Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 The scholarship is no good if you can’t go on campus. Scholarship provided housing is no good if it’s on campus. You simply shouldn’t deny basic rights without due process. Playing time is a bit different, an administrative decision must be made in accord with school policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Hail Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 12 minutes ago, KUGRDON said: The scholarship is no good if you can’t go on campus. Scholarship provided housing is no good if it’s on campus. You simply shouldn’t deny basic rights without due process. Playing time is a bit different, an administrative decision must be made in accord with school policy. Seems that this is the root of Oregon's problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KUGRDON Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 29 minutes ago, All Hail said: Seems that this is the root of Oregon's problem. WSU suspended a player from the team only to have a court intervene and overturn the suspension because school policy did not provide adequate due process. It’s a thorny problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBug708 Posted October 26, 2017 Author Share Posted October 26, 2017 1 hour ago, KUGRDON said: I think AH just did, insofar as keeping them off campus generally denies them the benefits of scholarships, as many do. AH is harder on it then I am I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quack 12 Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 2 hours ago, All Hail said: I think campuses have an obligation to remove students who they have a strong reason to believe are dangerous to campus. If a student was accused of murder, he should not be allowed to walk the campus while his due process is figured out. If a student is a accused of rape and there is strong witness evidence that he very well might be a rapist, I don't think he should be allowed to prowl the campus. The university is hiding behind due process and plausible deniability and they are doing so intentionally for the sole purpose of benefiting their athletic department. Interesting word choice, considering that you're discussing due process. It seems pretty obvious that the university was deliberately obfuscating to protect the athletic department, and whether or not Altman knew the reason for the investigation, he certainly should have known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 On 10/26/2017 at 9:25 AM, All Hail said: I think campuses have an obligation to remove students who they have a strong reason to believe are dangerous to campus. If a student was accused of murder, he should not be allowed to walk the campus while his due process is figured out. If a student is a accused of rape and there is strong witness evidence that he very well might be a rapist, I don't think he should be allowed to prowl the campus. The university is hiding behind due process and plausible deniability and they are doing so intentionally for the sole purpose of benefiting their athletic department. I don't agree with this at all. If we're going to be a country where we presume innocence, then rights should not be stripped from the accused until he's found guilty beyond reasonable doubt. Bail, civil asset forfeiture, onerous attorney fees and other restrictions set by the court already destroy the lives of millions who are accused of crimes and later found not guilty. There is no method of getting your life back if the state turns out to be wrong, and you're NOT guilty. This is not how justice works in most of the civilized world (many western European countries allow recourse for those indicted and brought to trial, yet found innocent), and it shouldn't be how it works here. Bail is already, in my mind, used unconstitutionally in this country. Now we're talking about setting precedents where everyone gets their educational opportunities stripped as a penalty for accusations? No thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PapaG Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 On 10/26/2017 at 9:25 AM, All Hail said: I think campuses have an obligation to remove students who they have a strong reason to believe are dangerous to campus. If a student was accused of murder, he should not be allowed to walk the campus while his due process is figured out. If a student is a accused of rape and there is strong witness evidence that he very well might be a rapist, I don't think he should be allowed to prowl the campus. The university is hiding behind due process and plausible deniability and they are doing so intentionally for the sole purpose of benefiting their athletic department. So a woman making a false accusation can destroy a student-athlete's life and get them booted from school.l with zero due process, and you're fine with it. Grab a pitchfork, Adolf. As for Altman being a "scumbag," that's just a stupid take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBug708 Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 Pretty sure that's a take shared by most fan bases not centered in Eugene. He does have a certain draw to potential or alleged rapists. Did he recruit Kobe at one time? At least your rapist coach can coach, ours sucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Hail Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 1 hour ago, PapaG said: So a woman making a false accusation can destroy a student-athlete's life and get them booted from school.l with zero due process, and you're fine with it. Grab a pitchfork, Adolf. As for Altman being a "scumbag," that's just a stupid take. How do all the rapists and sexual predators always end up on your campus? Why don't they show up in Westwood, Berkeley or Palo Alto? Altman is a great coach but there is no doubt he is a scumbag. Sorry if it truth hurts your feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glduck Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 so it should be pretty apparent by now that i'm not on altman's side for this. but you two are clearly trolling Papa, and it's doing a disservice to your argument. recruiting players with known sexual misconduct is wrong, and to do it again after the first instance blew up in your face is both stupid and wrong. that right there wins the argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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